East wind - effect on fishing

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#1 Post by **MackDublin** » Mon May 30, 2011 11:38 pm

I fish the East Coast and its generally accepted that an easterly breeze is not good for fishing but does that count for our entire coast?
Is an easterly breeze a negative for fishing the west, south and north of Ireland?
Lastly, if its been blowing northerly, westerly or southerly and it changes to easterly (lets say a moderate 15mph breeze) how many tides does it take for the fishing to start deteriorating?

Cheers
Colm

#2 Post by **fishermandan007** » Mon May 30, 2011 11:57 pm

Colm wrote:I fish the East Coast and its generally accepted that an easterly breeze is not good for fishing but does that count for our entire coast?
Is an easterly breeze a negative for fishing the west, south and north of Ireland?
Lastly, if its been blowing northerly, westerly or southerly and it changes to easterly (lets say a moderate 15mph breeze) how many tides does it take for the fishing to start deteriorating?

Cheers
Colm

brilliant question mate wondered that also, il be curious to see what peoples theories are...

#3 Post by **stevo74** » Mon May 30, 2011 11:59 pm

I would imagine that the south east would fish better in an easterly but only on the basis that it seems to fish better anyhow regardless of the wind direction. For me, the trick is to fish the days just after the easterlies have been blowing but really depends what you after as different species can be caught in different winds and some prefer no wind at all !

#4 Post by **chuckaroo** » Tue May 31, 2011 1:23 am

Colm wrote:I fish the East Coast and its generally accepted that an easterly breeze is not good for fishing but does that count for our entire coast?
Is an easterly breeze a negative for fishing the west, south and north of Ireland?
Lastly, if its been blowing northerly, westerly or southerly and it changes to easterly (lets say a moderate 15mph breeze) how many tides does it take for the fishing to start deteriorating?

Cheers
Colm

An easterly breeze means absolutely NOTHING as far as i am concerned.
There is no concrete evidence as to its negative effect, i have caught plenty of fish in an east wind.

The reason why people say an easterly isnt good to fish in is mainly because it is meant to bring cold air but not all easterlies do bring cold air, some originate from the south east. so ok, if an easterly IS a cold easterly originating from Scandinavia/Russia/Arctic and it blows for a day or two then yes it will probably deter a hatch of a certain insect or fly on a lake when it comes to TROUT fishing. But freshwater fishing only, it just doesn't hold-up in sea fishing.

The only time that an easterly will ever be brought into consideration when fishing in the sea is if your coast line faces east and you want to head out fishing in a boat. The chances are the waves will be bigger and that just means less comfortable or maybe unsafe fishing, nothing more.

its a gossiping myth as far as i'm concerned mate. some people look into it all a bit too much.

as i said, i have caught plenty of fish in an east wind and yet of course, on the other side, I have blanked many times in each and every other wind direction....

.
Go out and find out for yourself...

Cheers

p.s. furthermore... on the subject of trout fishing,... I remember last year a mate telling me that going for a days mayfly fly-fishing for brown trout to a lake was 'a waste of time' because there was an east wind; he said that he had spoken to a lot of other fishermen and they had all agreed. But anyway, i insisted that we should at least give it a go because it was the only chance we could get off work and the boat was already booked - he came. there were very few boats out on the water and we had the place to ourselves; the east wind continued all through the day but it wasnt cold at all. there were plenty of mayfly and the fish were feeding well on the surface, the fishing was great!!!
also, only last week i was fishing at the same place with another friend. he told me how he remembered fishing one day before and how the wind had changed to an easterly for '5 minutes', no more. He said that it was true, that the fish had stopped feeding during that time. i near laughed.

#5 Post by **JimH** » Tue May 31, 2011 12:24 pm

From a bass fishing perspective these have been my experiences based on the normal expectation as a fishing guide since 2003 in Wexford.

Fly and lure from the shore only.
Average number of customers fishing per week is 2.68 (I know!)
Fishing twice per day for 4 hours
Fishing five days per week
Fishing 9 weeks of the season
This represents 965 hours of fishing # it’s probably more
These are and have been experienced and capable anglers, not beginners or people learning.
Lure fishing average fish take per session in eight years is 8 fish
Fly fishing average fish take per session in eight years is 2 fish

This can be much greater or lesser and is running – for instance I did witness three anglers take 115 fish in three hours – (these are treated as exceptional)
On average taking into account outliers the fish take when the systems are performing is 135 fish per week –
This equates to approx. - 1215 fish per season or

Total average over last 8 years is approximately 9720 fish- 99.9% caught and returned –actual numbers are remarkable close.

Last year I personally passed the 1000th bass caught on the fly

There are patterns in this significant numbers of hours and time spent bass fishing - data as regards lure/fly type – location – presentation- colour-retrieve –size-noise - timings, tides and weather influences.

Some seasons since 2003 have been much better than others

For instance 2004 2005 and 2006 recorded higher numbers than 2007 2008 and 2009, 2010 was back to 2007 levels.

As the customer base and business changed towards fly fishing there was a subsequent decrease in returns – this does not mean that fish numbers declined
Significantly – from mid-2007 through 2008 and into 2009 heavy rain falls and slow moving low pressure systems played havoc with water quality and fish return rates – it was very difficult considering I was moving customers towards more fly oriented business.

Easterly breezes are caused by the ‘bottoms or lower mid sections’ of high pressure systems, they are also caused by the tops and upper mid sections of low pressure systems. Easterly sea breezes caused locally during the day arrive after sunup and disappear in late evening.
The main influences on the fish are tides and weather – there are others like forage, location etc

I have found the following generally -

• In a light easterly breeze like that which blew in early April bass can be caught - < force 3 or 4
• As wind speed and longevity (number of days) increase the likelihood of catching bass decreases > force 4 <= force 5
• As wind speed and longevity (number of days) increase there is a decrease in corresponding quality of water clarity
• The longer the influence and the greater the strength the greater the impact, particularly if the wind moves to the north east
• Fish will tend to move off the top into lower water or bottom holding positions over time
• It’s always better to match your presentations to where the fish are – they will move lower as it prolongs or increases and eventually move off
• Fish ‘off time’ can be a period of re-adjustment
• Catching an early tide or tides in a weather system with strong easterly or south easterly breezes can produce amazing results in white water
• This will not last for long or for every tide
• There is a significant decrease in catch returns as exhibited by the data from the source above
• Fishing can improve in one tidal sequence often dramatically as weather patterns shift
• BASS CAN BE CAUGHT ON EASTERLIES

#6 Post by **MackDublin** » Tue May 31, 2011 1:50 pm

Thanks Jim, great post.

jw · #7 Post by jw » Tue May 31, 2011 2:54 pm

i disagree. supposing you were to collect data on red headed women seen while fishing, you could even
record how long the red hair was, different shades of red hair etc, im sure you could imagine all sorts
of patterns there if you looked long enough, its unlikely you would catch the exact same number of fish
for each length of red hair, don't think it would really prove anything though

#8 Post by **Donnyboy1** » Tue May 31, 2011 3:19 pm

Jim thats quite a lot of data (good and useful data I'll be using, ta

)
But I think your conclusions are speculative.... as I cannot see any methodology that could yield a 'stastically significant' conclusion....

Thats scientifically speaking... but the old fishermen didn't use science... but then again the old fishermen used experience and folklore such as these rhymes...

TBH I'm not sure it would be easy to prove it? You would need control groups and large populations and all groups would need to be identical to eliminate any bias... a very tall order!

#9 Post by **Ste** » Tue May 31, 2011 5:21 pm

jw wrote:i disagree. supposing you were to collect data on red headed women seen while fishing, you could even
record how long the red hair was, different shades of red hair etc, im sure you could imagine all sorts
of patterns there if you looked long enough, its unlikely you would catch the exact same number of fish
for each length of red hair, don't think it would really prove anything though

Red headed women don't usually like kelp beds, gullies, white water and lures during a rising spring tide on a windy beach... But if you change those factors for nightclubs, alcopops, free credit cards and champaign during a heat spell in a city centre on a bank holiday you'd have an equation worth looking at!

#10 Post by **JimH** » Tue May 31, 2011 5:26 pm

Its an interesting one no doubt, and establishing a 'control' would be a welcome addition if possible - im not claiming anything specific other than the data i have collected is not 'imagined' and it shows a decrease in returns when it goes easterly or north easterly. Now it does this too when it goes south westerly and blows up, returns will decrease, I normally attribute this to deteriorating water quality as can happen in a strong easterly also - but there seems to be something else at play when an easterly blows.

Theres a post on the site somewhere (this is just an example nothing else)- we made an article for Peche en Mer magazine in 2008 - Danny Raoux from France was the journalist/angler who fished with me that week along with Nico de Boer from Holland another journalist - both very experienced bass anglers especially Danny - both Danny Nico and myself fished from Sunday through to Thursday over a spring tidal sequence up to ten hours a day in a NE/E breeze - you work even harder during editorial time - for the five days and some (3X5X10) hours and numerous locations and techniques we had three fish, interesting, we caught fish in an easterly! - on friday morning the wind switched SW at about 01:00 - we made the article photos between 06:00 and 08:30 Danny and Nico went home happy, I went to bed a little tired - we hit and landed 8 fish that morning session and 12 the next.

It happens too regularly for me not to notice the differences - as to why well i guess thats just fishing - I do have a red headed girl from New Zealand who is a regular customer - top right hand photo on http://www.bassfishing.ie - do women catch more fish than men in an easterly breeze?

#11 Post by **JimH** » Tue May 31, 2011 5:39 pm

Colm and guys, sorrreeee - Bob Moss has noticed changes in bass behaviour on the Dingle peninsula during easterlies too - if you ever get the chance have a chat with him. I recently wanted to move a three day workshop out of Wexford to Dingle becasue of the bloody wind, rang Bob and he more or less said stay at home (this could have been for other reasons, but no they were affected there too) Jim Clohessy also has 'feelings' about this, as a matter of fact quite a number of people do....it is interesting though.

#12 Post by **MackDublin** » Tue May 31, 2011 6:13 pm

Thanks again Jim, great info.

#13 Post by **JBAXTERMANNI** » Tue May 31, 2011 7:02 pm

Just an old Fish wifes tale lol.

#14 Post by **Sweetwrasse** » Tue May 31, 2011 9:33 pm

Very interesting post and very difficult to come to a concrete conclusion. The numbers could be analysed but coming up with a control would be a nightmare!
The observations outlined above do seem to point to some sort of effect though and I'll try to use them during my fishing. It's times like these that I'm glad I'm a microbiologist and not a statistician

Thanks for posting guys, lots of food for thought!

#15 Post by **chuckaroo** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 12:56 am

some interesting stuff there JimH, you have put a lot of time and effort in no doubt and have recorded a lot of interesting observations. i can only respect your opinion.
you were saying that these easterlies churn-up and dirty the water so of course this will affect your lure/fly-fishing efforts, so why not stick on a bait and hope to get them that way then.... (i know, you dont bait fish for them..

)
some of the guys have pointed out that some of your opinions dont seem fully supported, that they are speculative and that there are too many other variables and factors that would need to be taken into account to prove a definite result, i would have to agree with them.
im taking nothing away from your observations but i still wouldnt let an easterly deter me from heading out fishing (especially when bait fishing!), so im going to stick with my original post.
great effort

cheers

#16 Post by **Donnyboy1** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 8:09 am

chuckaroo wrote:some of the guys have pointed out that some of your opinions dont seem fully supported, that they are speculative and that there are too many other variables and factors that would need to be taken into account to prove a definite result, i would have to agree with them.
great effort cheers

Even tho it isn't proved / justified at the moment, I would still be cautious of wind patterns, like everything else... even if I can't prove them

#17 Post by **JimH** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 9:43 am

I'm delighted that theres a microbiologist commenting here - I often wondered about the 'down the chain knock on effect' for want of a better word - is it possible SWrasse that under certain conditions things 'switch off' or behave differently lower down the food chain which in turn ripples up?

I'm glad that easterlies play a small part in my business!

jw · #18 Post by jw » Wed Jun 01, 2011 10:41 am

everybody knows for a particular mark the wind direction may affect the surf or the visibility,
and it may be better to move around the corner to a different facing mark.
The question asked at the start is could one direction of wind apply for all marks
facing all directions for all techniques and species, fresh and salt. How could something this bizarre
possibly be true for all species? how do they know "there's a bit of east in the wind today"
where do they get the compasses?

#19 Post by **nicefish** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 10:55 am

jw wrote:everybody knows for a particular mark the wind direction may affect the surf or the visibility,
and it may be better to move around the corner to a different facing mark.
The question asked at the start is could one direction of wind apply for all marks
facing all directions for all techniques and species, fresh and salt. How could something this bizarre
possibly be true for all species? how do they know "there's a bit of east in the wind today"
where do they get the compasses?

Instinct.

jw · #20 Post by jw » Wed Jun 01, 2011 11:35 am

anybody on here work in a fish farm? the theory goes fish dont feed when the
wind is from the east, does that mean the dont bother throwing the pellets in
on days when the wind is from the east?

Sea Angling Ireland