King Rag

have anyone tried King Rag from the shore? Its the most convenient fresh bait at my disposal and I was wondering how it fared with other anglers. Local opinion to date is killer for boat and shore and boat bait only.

I find it just as good as normal rag. I usually use it with mackeral on a size 4/0 hook. Have caught many a fish this way.

Read it certainly can be a good bait at times. just make sure you use hooks big enough to present them on. you will get away with smaller hooks using a pennell. try 2/0 + depending on size and quantity on hook. maybe someone else can advise better? small 1 or 2" chunks tipped with mackeral, sandeel, mussel, etc. can be a good 'small' fish bait on 3 hook flappers and will catch a lot of species.

Mark

up to now I have been halving the worm, they are mostly 15 cm long, and threading onto the hook or more recently threading a whole worm up the snood. I then double the tail to allow about 5 cm showing beyond the hook tipping with squid, before wrapping with elastic. I have also begun using 3/0 hooks and I was wondering where to go from here. I see Ronald Surgenor in another thread recommend 6/0 hooks :shock: . The different choices of rigs, hooks, baits and bait presentation is a bit overwhelming at the moment so I am trying to rationalise it down to a few that I will use consistently.

I must say though I am uncomfortable with any of the bait not being within a say 5 cm of the barb. The Pennel rigs definetly address this but baiting up the snood doesn't.

Declan what do you mean by 'doubling the tail back'? you are right about the endless rig designs, hook patterns and sizes, etc. most anglers try a few and then stick with what works for them. as regards presentation well it depends on many different things. for example, fish size, size and type of bait, etc. sometimes you will catch more by increasing or decreasing your hook size depending on the day. it can be difficult to answer because fish respond to different things in different locations and conditions. a good piont to remember is to choose a hook that fits the bait comfortably and make sure the barb is exsposed. you will miss fish crambing too big a bait onto too small a hook.

generally a full 15cm. worm will fish on a single 1/0 or 2/0 long shank easily. a pennell is more useful when you are threading up lots of worms say 5 or 6 of these size worms. then you could use a size 3/0 short shank top hook and a 2/0 bottom hook. when tipping with squid there is no need to to whip with elastic unless you want to wrap the worm in it or are casting further out and you want a neater more aerodynamic bait. 6/0's are most likely to be used with whole squid baits, whole or sectioned mackeral(or any fish!) and large crab/ mussel baits combined with worms. a big fish hook really.

for a start a 2 or 3 hook flapper is a great all round rig and a consistant fish catcher. make sure you have a few of these. wishbones/ bombers or even a single hook clipped rig are good distance rigs. rough ground rigs can be a simple affair, use a strong line for the rig body and use loop knots instead of swivels, weak links and a heavier mainline of 25lb. plus. there are a few post on the 'tips and tricks' section on the site on this topic.

hope some of this helps Declan. keep firing away with the questions.

Mark,

my metric conversion arithmetic has let me down :oops: I meant 20cm and often the worms are 30cm. What I meant be by doubling the tail back is if I had say 15cm hanging off the end of the hook rather than giving the fish a freebie I would turn the tail back over the hook again and tie it with elastic. That way the hook passes through the body once, the body would then lie alonside it on the way up and then back down again. In effect the worm is folded over on itself. By the way I use this at night when I feel how the bait looks is less important than having a big scent.

I have been following the advice you gave, though generally sticking to two hook paternosters, bomber and pulley (usually pennel) rigs. For whiting, flattie and doggies I use to 1/0 or 2/0 hooks. I have caught codling also but no cod and other larger species. That's why I'm spreading my wings bit.

makes sense Read. i see what you mean. a 12" king would fit nicely on a 4/0 hook. whipping the tail back over the upper half of the rag is a good idea and will give you a bulky bait rather than a long bait. it is a good single hook option as it will keep bait nearer to the hookpiont. 6/0+ hooks are used for the likes of conger, huss, big bass, cod, tope, specimen wrasse, ray and the like. use a bait to match the hooksize. general rule, big fish, big baits. however you will land a big fish on a strong hook as i am sure you know. on many venues using a three hook flapper for general species can be a more enjoyable way to catch fish whilst waiting for better things. otherwise try a 2 rod option if you can. fish 3 hooks between 2 rods. 2hook flapper on one with a one hook, big bait on the other. your rig chioce seems fine. concentrating on these rigs and making them up to suit your own fishing needs is a good idea. this takes time and means getting out to the beach and learning the hard way! it sounds like your doing alright because your catchin a few! keep looking at fishing websites for tips on catching big fish. don't tell Kieran(!) but Mike Thrussell's 'worldseafishing' site is good, as is http://www.fishing.co.uk. do a search and look at Henry Gilbey's articles.

Mark
thanks for the advice. Even when it confirms what I am doing is OK it's of great benefit. Doing most of my fishing solo it a confidence boost to have more experienced heads confirm that I am on the right track. I have been using two rod exactly as you suggested but sometimes I think this is too much like hard work. I tend to change the baits every 15 minutes or so and this doesn't allow much time to relax and take it all in 8) . After all this is supposed to be a leisure activity!

I have begun using Mike Thrussels site again recently and there are some great tips there. The other site is new to me but I have corresonded twice with Henry Gilbey. The last occasion was to point him in the direction of a Mag kit for his beloved SL20SH. He bemoaned the lack of Mag braking in the SLOSH in an article on his site comparing various multipliers. On both occasions he replied to my mails and comes across as a very personable character.

Anyway I'm beginning to ramble on so again I much obliged for your help.

no worries. i just wish more people had of replied to your post. i certainly don't have all the answers. 2 rods can be tough going. when fishing one rod with a large bait you can get away with leaving it for prolonged periods without changing the bait. people will probably jump down my neck for saying this claiming that replacing baits regularly is a key factor in catching. not always! i am convinced that bass can be spooked by leads being cast near them in shallow water. i usually bait up a suitable hook with enough bait on it for a few casts and leave it out there (obviuosly when there are few crabs or bait robbing tiddlers). a large number of the worms are only nicked onto the hook so they will still retain their guts after a long time in the water. it has worked for me before, getting fish 45min. (and more) after the cast has been made. it just means you can reduce the 'scare factor' of the lead. good from shallow sandy beaches or shallow rock marks.
crab is a good bait for this too as the juices can take time to come out, particularly if you are using it whole and have not cut it or whipped it too tightly with cotton. this is how they are when fish find them isn't it? perhaps the best of all would be live/ dead bait. oils from fish can seep out continuously for a long time. you can simply reel it in once and a while and puncture it with a bait needle and lob it out again. you could also try stuffed squid baits. the baits inside the squid will release their juices slower. there are a fw things you can try. anyway now i'm rambling! your pleasure fishing, take your time and most of all enjoy!

Gilling for pollack using head hooked kings is deadly for pollack off the boats. Kings are great for bass in the surf tipped with mackerel.

'Ere George, where'd you get that pic of me? :P