Fishfinder and GPS

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Fishfinder and GPS

Postby jgraham768 » Sat Mar 22, 2014 3:00 pm

Well lads almost finished with my shetland overhaul and its electronic buying time, I'm absolutely torn between a few choices and I'd love some input and advice!
I've found myself a beautiful Lowrance 5-Elite DSI which in essence is GPS/Fishfinder/DownImaging and for a serious price BUT it's U.S. so the GPS will basically be no good and cost me around 200 squids to get a worldwide base map and then another 200 if i want a more detailed localized mapping software. I also thought of getting the 5x-Elite which is essencially the same system but without the GPS and get a good GPS, Garmin or the like later on.
Then i discovered the Garmin Echomap 50s which is a GPS/fishfinder, no down imaging and no hard bottom reference in the fishfinder.

So I'm confused and lost at the same time, any help appreciated.

John
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Species of 2014 (1): Pollock

Species of 2013 (13): (coarse) Brown Trout, Seatrout, Salmon
(sea) Pollock, Mackerel, Cod, Ling, Bass, Dogfish, Coalie, Ballan Wrasse, Cuckoo Wrasse, Mullet


Species of 2012 (11): (coarse) brown trout, seatrout, pike, roach
(sea) mackerel, Spanish mackerel, pollock, cuckoo wrasse, coalie, cod, dogfish, bass
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby JimC » Sat Mar 22, 2014 5:17 pm

I use Garmin....
DSI is a bit of a gimmick at sea. It does not work well at depth, not when I tried it out. There is a new model EchoMap that has DSI... Not sure if it's available in the shops yet.

You would have to explain what you mean by "hard bottom reference".

I think you will find that all GPS units have a worldwide base map installed. It will be the extra cartography that will cost you. The Garmins tend to come with cartography installed.
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby jgraham768 » Sun Mar 23, 2014 1:46 am

Ya the DSI only works to about 300ft fresh water but i only want it to diagnose the ground i'm fishing on in max 50-60ft to see bottom weed conditions and sea floor structures etc, i watched a few videos of the lowrance and to be honest the DSI looks the bees. Ya the echomap with DSI retails at about 500 quid plus shipping, i could get the lowrance 5x and an actual specific GPS for that price. I guess the question i was mainly asking (but didn't say) was if the lowrance fishfinders are decent quality and what would be the better brands of GPS for in and around 250-300 that has waypoint, marks and all that jazz.

The hard bottom reference i was talking about was that the garmin 50s doesn't distinguish between various bottoms and i've been told that the lowrance fishfinders show a white line for bottom when it's gravel-rock bottom and then the red-yellow for sand and weed etc.

Ya the zone specific cartography is what i was talking about, but i don't really understand the difference? Do the basemaps have depth lines and such no?

Thanks Jim
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Species of 2014 (1): Pollock

Species of 2013 (13): (coarse) Brown Trout, Seatrout, Salmon
(sea) Pollock, Mackerel, Cod, Ling, Bass, Dogfish, Coalie, Ballan Wrasse, Cuckoo Wrasse, Mullet


Species of 2012 (11): (coarse) brown trout, seatrout, pike, roach
(sea) mackerel, Spanish mackerel, pollock, cuckoo wrasse, coalie, cod, dogfish, bass
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby JimC » Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:20 pm

I have not had enough success using DSI to be wanting it! I'll need to be convinced that it is not a gimmick at this time. I'm happiest with my HI-ID unit. Lowrance make good units. The HDS units are well regarded. I have used the HDS and the Global map units. Sometimes I feel that there are too many options/settings on some of the Lowrance units, especially the HDS. Garmin, Lowrance, Raymarine etc.... It's like your phone, everybody has their personal favourite. I used have Lowrance fish finders years ago. Every one of them had to go back to the factory at some stage. I've always used Garmin GPS (Except for a Magellan unit back in the day ;)). I changed to Garmin sounders and never had an issue, hence I am still using Garmin units.

There really is no such thing as "hard bottom reference" used in sounder terminology that I have encountered. All decent sounders will tell you how hard the bottom is. Greyscale sounders tend to call it "greyline" or "whiteline", colour units "colourline". In simple terms - Hard bottom, thicker line. Soft bottom, thinner line. The sounder built in to the Echomap 50S happens to be superb at determining hard/soft bottom.

There is a lot to sounders. Much of what is presented on screen is open to interpretation and practice makes perfect in use. If something is unclear, take a picture of the screen (Many units will now do this) and post it in a forum where other guys will point you in the right direction.
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby JimC » Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:41 pm

...... Oh The cartography.

All plotters have a basemap. For example: it will show you were Cork Harbour is but it will not show any contour lines or channels etc. That detailed info comes with the chart that is loaded to you unit.

In older times you would have to buy a card containing the charts for the area you operate in and plug this into your unit. These cards could cost €200. A few year back Garmin began to ship their plotters with built in charts. Lowrance to my knowledge do not ship on all units. If not you will have to buy a Navionics chart/card to insert into the machine. that's a bit of a poke if you have not budgeted for it!

I have not see a combo unit at that price. You might get a second hand unit or stump for a Garmin 451 or something of that nature...
You have to pay for the latest tech.... so the latest hi def combo is going to cost.

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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby CiaranMcFish » Thu Mar 27, 2014 1:02 pm

Yeah as jim says the down imaging and side imaging sonars on the recreational units are not much cop in deeper water, they do the business and are useful for understanding a bit more about features in water less than 30m depth. I had a small humminbird SI unit but i found that inevitably i didn't spend any time looking at the Side Imaging as i was too interested in fishing!! It's a whole new dimension but unless you leave the rod down and start paying attention you won't benefit much from it. I use commercial side scan and the recreational units are good for the money compared. I sold the humminbird and bought a combo Garmin 750i unit which is touchscreen, i got it second hand and it's a great job, big 7 inch screen and allows you to see good detail on chart and sonar together and then flick between. Can also be removed from boat after each trip to keep it dry and safe.
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby jgraham768 » Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:37 pm

Ya i'd say i'll probably get the Garmin after that and splash for the bluecharts then later on. A few other forums have said the Garmins have better reliability and that's more important for my budget at the moment. The 50s also comes with a down imaging version too if i decide i want to try it. Thanks for the Jim, always a pleasure, and thank you too Ciaran great advice!
A bad days fishing is still better then a good day at the office.

Species of 2014 (1): Pollock

Species of 2013 (13): (coarse) Brown Trout, Seatrout, Salmon
(sea) Pollock, Mackerel, Cod, Ling, Bass, Dogfish, Coalie, Ballan Wrasse, Cuckoo Wrasse, Mullet


Species of 2012 (11): (coarse) brown trout, seatrout, pike, roach
(sea) mackerel, Spanish mackerel, pollock, cuckoo wrasse, coalie, cod, dogfish, bass
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby JimC » Fri Mar 28, 2014 10:18 am

You won't need the bluechart with the Garmin. The installed chart is superb, in fact the "fishing chart" display on the 50s is unreal. It shows more detail than you normally get.

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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby donal domeney » Fri Mar 28, 2014 11:08 am

I have the older 550 garmin gps and the mapping is great and covers all Irish and uk waters. The newer 551's have more detail in the map.

Download this for doing your home work on fishing marks https://jetstream.gsi.ie/delivery/INFOM ... rth_ne.kmz
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby jgraham768 » Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:32 pm

donal domeney wrote:I have the older 550 garmin gps and the mapping is great and covers all Irish and uk waters. The newer 551's have more detail in the map.

Download this for doing your home work on fishing marks https://jetstream.gsi.ie/delivery/INFOM ... rth_ne.kmz



Ya I'm gonna get the garmin I'd say, I'm a bit more comfortable buying from an irish shop anyways!
Thanks for the infomar link too Dónal!
A bad days fishing is still better then a good day at the office.

Species of 2014 (1): Pollock

Species of 2013 (13): (coarse) Brown Trout, Seatrout, Salmon
(sea) Pollock, Mackerel, Cod, Ling, Bass, Dogfish, Coalie, Ballan Wrasse, Cuckoo Wrasse, Mullet


Species of 2012 (11): (coarse) brown trout, seatrout, pike, roach
(sea) mackerel, Spanish mackerel, pollock, cuckoo wrasse, coalie, cod, dogfish, bass
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby PhilD » Thu Apr 10, 2014 12:52 pm

If you haven't bought yet you could check out the new Lowrance Hybrid dual imaging (HDI) systems that are replacing the DSI units just released last month. I picked up a Lowrance 4x Elite HDI from the UK which cost a little bit more than it would have cost from the US with shipping and duty. The new HDI units also support the Insight Genisis Mapping system as well (where you collect your own sonar info and upload it to make your own depth charts)
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Currently making a retractable transom transducer gear for my unit so haven't fitted it yet but I am itching to have a go at it.
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby jgraham768 » Thu Apr 10, 2014 2:34 pm

PhilD wrote:If you haven't bought yet you could check out the new Lowrance Hybrid dual imaging (HDI) systems that are replacing the DSI units just released last month. I picked up a Lowrance 4x Elite HDI from the UK which cost a little bit more than it would have cost from the US with shipping and duty. The new HDI units also support the Insight Genisis Mapping system as well (where you collect your own sonar info and upload it to make your own depth charts)
Image

Currently making a retractable transom transducer gear for my unit so haven't fitted it yet but I am itching to have a go at it.
Phil



That does look pretty cool but I'm afraid i've already made the purchase.. :?
A bad days fishing is still better then a good day at the office.

Species of 2014 (1): Pollock

Species of 2013 (13): (coarse) Brown Trout, Seatrout, Salmon
(sea) Pollock, Mackerel, Cod, Ling, Bass, Dogfish, Coalie, Ballan Wrasse, Cuckoo Wrasse, Mullet


Species of 2012 (11): (coarse) brown trout, seatrout, pike, roach
(sea) mackerel, Spanish mackerel, pollock, cuckoo wrasse, coalie, cod, dogfish, bass
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby PhilD » Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:46 pm

Ooh, what did you go for in the end?
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Re: Fishfinder and GPS

Postby jgraham768 » Fri Apr 11, 2014 12:34 pm

The garmin echomap 50s. Chuffed to bits with it!
A bad days fishing is still better then a good day at the office.

Species of 2014 (1): Pollock

Species of 2013 (13): (coarse) Brown Trout, Seatrout, Salmon
(sea) Pollock, Mackerel, Cod, Ling, Bass, Dogfish, Coalie, Ballan Wrasse, Cuckoo Wrasse, Mullet


Species of 2012 (11): (coarse) brown trout, seatrout, pike, roach
(sea) mackerel, Spanish mackerel, pollock, cuckoo wrasse, coalie, cod, dogfish, bass
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