Master Angler

Having just returned from fishing this years Master Angler I am a bit bemused.
Firstly congratulations to the prize winners, the organisers and all concerned for a well run competition.

My bemusement however is with the way the goalposts for the competition is constantly moving.For a competition that is a qualifier for the World Championships you would think that it would be fished under the same rules.This was the case in Downings a few years ago but since then things have changed.

Success, in my opinion, in the Masters in the last few years is dependant on the following, 1, Access to copious amounts of ragworm,2,the amount of gear eg. quivertip rods etc you can kit youself out with 3,being with the "in "crowd for the latest informaton etc.

God be with the days where you were allowed only 2 rods and 1 trace outside your tackle box.
Why is the competition not fished at anchor like CIPS world championship?
Why is each angler not allocated the same amount of bait each like CIPS?

The amount of expense that one has to go to is growing all the time and then it costs even more if you are lucky enough to make the team.It is no surprise to me that tackle shop owners have figured as prize winners in both the Masters and Findlater in recent years.The best of luck to them, I am just illustrating my point, nothing personal here I assure you I have no reason to be jealous.

My main point is that the powers that be need to sort out an exact qualification method to give every angler a fair chance.

If you think thats bad just wait to see the cock up they have made with the masters (shore). 5 of us from Cork still hav'nt got any accomadation and I suspect its the same all over.

Billy give this number a ring and ask for Margret Rooney give my name she should have a house it 's in mullaghmore harbour xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.

[Contact original poster directly for number]

hi,
Totally agreee with fastnet, though things have improved, the bait issue will always be a MASSIVE disadvantage to anglers not having access and finance to buy 1000's of rag.
Why focus on rag.
Well, as most people who have fished the MA comps will know, pollock and wrasse, will often make up most of a competitors score, ( unless it is held in cork area, when the conger is king, great practise for catching sardines in the med)
Many a time i have been in comps, when the anglers with copius amounts of rag, win the boat, when i have managed to get a lot of rag, funny old thing, i have won boat sessions because i can load up the hooks.
I have also fished the restricted bait comps fished by EFSA, and it is definately the way to go, its a level playing field, relying on the anglers skill to manage his bait supplies, to the type of ground he/she is fishing.
Thus making the anglers much better allrounder's! and not conger specialists, pollock specialists etc etc.
As for the amount of tackle, well it can make a difference, but restricting that would be difficult, prehaps, the line could be restricted as in the European championships.
The point that you raised regarding the world champs.
WHY the hell can the qualification master angler champs not be fished in the same way as the world champs?????? You only have to read in the angling mags the amount of practice the italians, england etc put in to this comp, and with good results. You would hardly pick a team of rugby players to go and represent there country in hockey!( ie they both play on a pitch) But thats the way we are currently picking the fishing team, strange.
Finally, a point for debate, SIZE LIMITS!! again in the angling press re the world champs, you have all seen the size of the fish they are catching abroad! sprats, because thats all thats left in some seas.
The numbers of fish caught were quoted at this years MA, around 2000, and another figure of 3000 was noted as the the fish that were undersized.
You may well have had a situation there that an angler might have thrashed the other competitors on the boat, but beacuse they were "undersized" he gets nothing, does it make him a bad angler??
Would he have been the better choice for the mediterranean venues when sprats count? after all its still "fishing" ie catching fish
And the big question, Can you really target the IN SIZE fish when fishing for pollock and wrasse, maybe if you use 6/0 hooks, but what does that prove.
The IFSA, know the venues , methods to be used, ( anchour etc), the baits, and most likely fish species to be caught for the following years world champs
So , Run the qualification event as close as possible to next world champs, most likely you will get a team that will suit the venue.
Ireland has a host of brilliant, talented anglers and should be regularly in the top five in the world, best of luck to all that qualified this year for the world champs.
regards
screeming reels

True points screeming...

Your right why don't we really create a level playing and restrict angling we could set up on the boats and beaches and play cards for the master angler you would probably get a better team that way.

Here we go again billy

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Hi,
Cards would be a good idea! no smelly bait to deal with.
Something wrong with a level playing field?
Is having a better prepared team a disadvantage?
Or is it fortune favours the wealthy or the lucky sod with rag beds on there doorstep!!!

Just dug these this afternoon 500 in a hour between myself and the younglad in my back garden. it's great to be rich.

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a question for all, there'e a lot of talk about the way the rules should be and most would be of the opinion that the way world championships is fished is the way forward , myself included, if it was put in a motion would there be many against it,

when i fished the worlds, according to the rules in place conger was an ineligable specie, and max size hook was size 2.

there was no rule about keeping your lead on the bottom, but a rule of having attractors over the eye of the hook was not allowed, if that is adopted does that mean no more jelly worms.

food for thought

im also against the idea of a panel system being set up every angler deserves their equal chance!!!!!!!!!!!!

hi,
Nice one paul!, that would be enougth for the first session! only another 1500 to go!
Mickeyfish, size 2 hooks , conger not counting wow !
May i ask, did you feel well prepared to fish that small, and with the "restrictions" imposed regarding your rigs? Did you get much advice on how to fish the venue before you left to compete?
regards
screeming

We are Talking about a topic close to my heart.
We have come a huge way along the road in picking the teams to represent Ireland, and I think we are nearly there.
The next 2 steps we HAVE to take are to supply equal baits for each competitor, and fish the competition to the c.i.p.s world championships rules.
I believe that there should be no, or perhaps a nominal, size limit of say 15cm which would lead to even better anglers qualifying, ie those who catch the most fish, not those lucky enough to fluke a few fish over an over zealous size.
Also there should be a limit on all species, which will force the angler to keep refining his techniques, and go fishing for harder species which will teach him to be versatile, which is the most important trait in an international angler.
You could say that bait and bait collection are an important part of the sucessful anglers skills, but that is not really relevant any more.
Take rag worm as an example.
25/30 eu's was more than enough to buy all the rag you would have required to compete with the best in this years M.A competition, as a matter of fact less than 1/2 my fish over the 4 sessions were caught on Ragworm.
In the matter of quiver tip rods, probably the best all rounder is the Grauvell Anaga 270, used by many internationals including my self for the last 3 years...... cost..... 49.99 str!, b.t.w I didn't catch any of my qualifying fish over the 4 sessions on the quivertip!!
There is also no relevence in being with the "in crowd" ring the secretary of the relevent club before the competition and you will get a very good overview of the fishing for the area, thats all you need to do, as a case in point.. the "in crowd" had 2 boats hired to fish the friday of the masters weekend, and the information gleaned was useless, as the fishing turned out to be completely different from the fishing during the Masters..
As to the point that every angler deserves the same fair chance...... that is rediculous, and it's a point strongly made by many over the years, indeed there is a belief that any angler who pays his ifsa membership is as entitled to fish for an Irish team as any other member...........
So if I pay my membership to oxford rowing club, Iam asentitled torow in the olympics as steve redgrave ???????
No matter what restrictions you place on the fishing, bait restrictions, line or tackle restrictions, different rules, changing goalposts etc the same few dedicated, versatile anglers will rise to the top, if you don't believe that, here is a bit of information for you, take the top five in this years master angler, between them they have 26 international caps..........
And none of them own tackle shops......
As Gary Player once said " the more I practice, the luckier I get"

Dave

Way to go Dave...well said 8)

Tom.

toscreeming reels

i got no info we had to figure out everything as a team making the rigs took time but so do all rigs i have adopted this style of fishing to the way i fish over here and it seems to be paying off,

the biggest hook i used in the weekend of the masters was a size 2 and the averge size hook i was using was a size 4, the size of the hook does not restrict the size of the fish you catch

hi mickeyfish
thanks for the info, i was wondering if that was the case, as you said, adopting that approach to comps here is great practice. recently i have started to use size 2- 4 hooks, its amazing that they catch the larger fish very well, but also pick up the smaller species.
regards
screeming

I have always gone by the maxim a big hook will catch a big fish, but a big hook won't catch a small fish.
Typically when scratching in a competition, I will go down to Gamakatsu Ls-513s hooks in size 6. you will not bend these hooks with your fingers, and I have caught Ling up to 7lb, wrasse up to 5lbs, and blonde rays up to 12 1/2lbs on them without problem, and without exception all fish caught on these "sticky" sharp hooks are caught in the lip, or corner of the mouth.
Go small... you will be surprised.
Dave

Interesting lads, very interesting indeed. 8)

Please keep the views coming as it makes riveting reading and all views are most welcome from all.

Well said Dave Jolly, the cream will always come to the surface :wink:

Don't let this thread get ruined by people having a pop at one and other as it then becomes boring. :shock:

Theres is a lot of views here that the 'powers that be' should take further and really think about what is coming out. It's not rocket science really IMHO. If you fish to the rules as in the worlds then it gets every competitior into that way of thinking sooner rather than later. We have the talent in all the anglers who qualified so lets use there individual talents in in a pro-active way rather than in a reactive way when it's too late and we are playing catchup again. :roll:

Good luck to the team, you deserve it. :wink:

Steve

i have had the bait discussion a few times recently.

i am of the point of view that the angler that is willing to go to the effort to prepare baits of a wide variety will nearly always be rewarded, thats not to say that he will win, im prove of the not winning part :lol: .
if i am going to a venue, boat or shore, i will ALWAYS have the widest variety of baits that i need, i also always try and have enough of each bait that if its the only one producing i will have enough for the day. often this has resulted in me hitting the beachs at 10 or 11 pm to get a tide in winter, why bother?? because i want to do as well as i can.

why should the guy that shows up with a box of rust and rotted line with a rotten mackeral as bait be rewarded by giving him his bait for no effort?? those that cant dig bait can always order it. its not overly expensive, especially considering the price of gear or of chartering a boat!!

if comps go the way that you will be resticted to baits that everyone can get where will it stop: peeler, rag, maddies, whites are all hard to come by unless you put effort into them. lug can be hard got in some areas too, so should that be ruled out, come next spring there will be a shortage of sandeel as the bad summer has lead to poor returns (according to the no1 bait digger in dublin) so where does the equality line for bait get drawn???

rant over, hope it makes sense

I have to say that I agree with you Paul.
I can remember picking crab at 2am one january, when it was so cold that you cried from the pain in your fingers, :shock: and having to do it 2 or 3 nights in a row to get a doz or so crab.. and yes I felt that i deserved to win the competition on that basis alone... lol.
Dave