Bass.... C&R or 1 for the Table. Info and debate

When did fishing go from being a form of hunting to being a sport practised by people with too much time and money on their hands?

Pat,

The tone of your last email sounded like: “either the posting of pictures of dead fish stops, or I won't want to come here anymore”. Have things got that bad?

These kind of pictures only come up once, twice, maybe three times a year? And generally when they do, they start a “conversation” (politely put!) on bass and C & R. How many anglers have learned of the importance of catch and release on the back of this? Aren’t these kind of healthy and impassioned debates welcome? To quote Andy from a previous thread

”....its a democracy and everyone is entitled to their own opinion, I believe the term is debate. correct me if I'm wrong. Where do we debate these things if not online ?”

I appreciate your views and concerns, and understand them. I am also in awe at the time and effort some of you guys put into conservation. I practice catch and release of bass in 99% of cases. And personally I would not post a picture of a dead bass. But do I think that photo’s of dead fish should be banned at present? In a word, no.

I laid out my views for everyone to see in a previous thread on this. To summarise them, I believe that this site is for everyone and anyone. I DO NOT think that the policy of the site should be dictated by a minority of people, and unfortunately I do feel that, at present, you are in a minority. Remember this is a sea angling site, and although it has a very important section on conservation, the conservation section is only a small part of the bigger picture.

I don’t feel that people should have to state why they killed a fish. I don’t think people should have to confirm or deny reports of catch and release, unless they CHOOSE to do so. I personally stopped posting on most of my bass sessions, despite releasing 99% of fish. This is simply because the first reply to anyone posting a catch report on bass generally contains a one line, and quite accusatory response: “did you release them”. Not “nice bass, well done”. Or “great catch”. To me that’s a very sorry state of affairs to be in, and frankly, quite extreme. It was mentioned previously that people have stopped filling in the C&R part of the report form – maybe this is why? If I want to post on a bass report, do I feel I have to mention that all fish were released in order to please everyone who feels that all bass should be returned? Frankly, I don’t think I should have to, or answer questions on it either (and what’s to stop me lying about it anyway). I don’t push my views on others, and will not accept others pushing their views on me either.

This site has provided those interested in conservation with a great platform to discuss it.

In turn the conservationists have helped to enlighten and educate hundreds of anglers. However I would hate to think that people are being turned away from posting, and from the site, owing to what amounts to misplaced good intentions?

Hear hear Steve.
You will notice I havn't posted any reports over the last year or so because I can't be arsed reading the 2nd or 3rd reply which usually is "was it released Col" if it containes a photo.
SeanP was critiscised heavely when he posted a report of a cracking bass session which revealed the location in the photo for crying out loud.
Let me ask a question.How many people buy seaangler /totalseafishing/irishangler?
How many of those offended by the photos of dead fish have written in to complain?
What I am trying to get accross is that we shouldn't be critiscising an angler on this site just because he brought 1 cracking fish home for the pot.
Fair play to the staunch catch and release people for educating us in our ways and I think that almost all of us practice C&R most of the time but I feel it is wrong to be pushed onto us in such a fashion.
Can anyone honestly say they have NEVER brought one home?

sorry, but some people really have me totally lost here.....
i honestly think that some are not reading very post in the thread or taking in everything that is being said before they reply to it themselves.

[Gillaroo]

<admin>Removed comment jd</edit>

Thanks, Big Col for summing up what I suspect - and it's only a hunch is what the silent majority believe and practice. However, I don't believe we are being educated but rather, we are being harangued by a minority propaganda.

I've just seen the mackerel C&R thread and I am now truly convinced that the lunatics have taken over the asylum.

Last edited by Gillaroo on Fri Jan 12, 2007 9:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

QUESTION Gillaroo...whats rediculous about the mackeral catch and release report, at least it eductaed people that returning mackeral that have been handled is pointless, or does scientific proof mean nothing.........

[MAC]

Just back in the office after a few days.

Kev

I've spent the last twenty minutes formulating a reply to you
addressing each one of your points in turn etc etc

But you know what ... I just couldnt be arsed anymore

I guess its time for change

Andy

Hopefully not Andy, I for one enjoy reading some of the information that you and Pat put on this forum and as Steve said your view and opinions have helped educate many.

I hope one day we get the chance to meet up and have a beer and a chat. I think it might look like we are in a stand off, but I would say that our opinions are closer that this thread would indicate.

We seem to have two groups here, some who like pics of fish, dead or otherwise, others who dislike dead fish pics.

To be honest Pat, I'm not really a fan of Dead fish pics. Pictures look so much better if the fish is at the waters edge, or even better going back. I am a big fan of the low level, wide angle picture of the Angler releasing his catch. I make a point of getting one of these pics all my pike fishing trips (If I catch :roll: )

Again, as mentioned above, I look forward to the chance of meeting you and picking this conversation up over a beer or two.

Kev

Last edited by MAC on Fri Jan 12, 2007 1:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I think it might look like we are in a stand off, but I would say that our opinions are closer that this thread would indicate.

Well said. I think the same applies to many who have been posting here. We will all have differing views on the issues discussed here, but sometimes these need to be put to one side so that as a community we can [url=http://www.irishbass.org]address serious problems, such as large-scale illegal commercial netting and sale of Bass[/url].

I do have an extreme opinion as regards to keeping Bass and perhaps I should have sent an IM rather than a post regarding this topic but I was just curious. Certainly didnt expect all of this to kick off so my apologies.

My own feeling, and this is not directed at any individual, is that we make such noise about banning nets and yet some of us are keeping more than the 2 bass allowed per angler. And before anyone starts shouting I know an individual cant compete with the amount of bass taken in a net but its all relative.

I just feel that if the vast majority of us are really behind the conservation effort being made then we should try to return as many bass as possible. As Mac said they look just as good in a pic alive and returned.

My 5 cents is to just have a think before you kill a bass as to whether you really need it or not. Thats all.
Lets be honest, we would all like to catch more Bass so we as individuals can make a difference.

Contents deleted by MAC and PM sent

I see you've already had a reply deleted on this topic Lampoon. I guess another one wont make a difference!

Eoghan,the point I am trying to raise is that,in my opinion,the huge majority of anglers on this site practise c&r but many are being aleinated by a few by the harsh critism that comes with the posting of 1 fish or as mentioned in my earlier post even by giving the location of a good session away in a photo.
In fairness I can see your point in giving away the location but perhaps the way to go is to send a pm to the poster with your concerns and not by critiscing openly on the forum.

Hi Col,

I know and have seen what you mean on the forum and I know its put others off posting reports on the forum. Because of this I feel annoyed at some members of the forum as they've removed an important information source even though I'm sure they've the best intentions.

It might be worth while doing what I do and post reports in the form of a blog with access to register members. The option is then there to only have a list of friends with access to the blog or to block a user.

Donagh

6 pages and counting! Obviously some people are very exercised by this issue... thats their right I suppose, but I think the tone of the debate is getting a bit too antagonistic.

Personally, each to their own is my motto. If an angler wants to release all his fish, that is his right, and fair play to him/her. If he wants to keep all his fish, as long as he adheres to legal minimum sizes and bag limits, or seasons for bass and sea trout, that is also his right. I don't think any of us, whatever our stance, has the right to abuse someone for doing either.
This isn't the catch-and-release angling forum, nor is it the kill-everything forum. Last time I checked, it was the Sea Angling Ireland forum, which encompasses anglers from both ends of the spectrum.

When i see a pic of an obviously undersize bass, or several dead bass obviously caught in one session, then I reserve the right to get annoyed. Otherwise, what right have I to criticise someone for taking a fish for the pot??? And I don't have any right to demand that he justify taking that fish either.
Perhaps energies would be better spent on writing to ministers asking for more protection, increased size limits/conservation, etc..........

As the line goes......Why can't we all just get along?!! :shock:

Eoghan,the point I am trying to raise is that,in my opinion,the huge majority of anglers on this site practise c&r but many are being aleinated by a few by the harsh critism that comes with the posting of 1 fish or as mentioned in my earlier post even by giving the location of a good session away in a photo.
In fairness I can see your point in giving away the location but perhaps the way to go is to send a pm to the poster with your concerns and not by critiscing openly on the forum.

You have lost me Col, I didnt think I criticised anyone in my post or mentioned anything about location..?
I do agree that some people get too carried away when posting though.

Content removed to WSC. PM Sent.

Ye it wasnt a malicious comment or anything, it was just humerous, tyring to bring a bit of humour to an increasingly serious topic and the moderator decided it was best removed , ive no problem with that, thats his job as moderator!!

Wow - looks like while this old man has been out a fishing you internet fans have been having a little bit of fun indoors. Took six pages of red herring 'catch n' release' v 'one for the pot' debating to come back full circle. Thankfully I think most people here are in favour of a sensible approach to stock protection. Reminds me of that controversy last week when people realised hanging was nasty - everybody knew it was happening but only kicked up when they saw the pictures.
On a lighter note, some bass had at Laytown this week.

Last edited by W F Sweeney on Sat Jan 13, 2007 1:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

Sorry Eoghan.I didn't mean you in particular.

Long before joining this site I came here as a visitor and I've seen this kind of debate many times, as have many of the members, as it tends to crop up every couple of months. In this case it was sparked by Roger posing with an obviously dead, mature bass in what I can only assume is his home. To be honest most of us here would be ecstatic to have caught that fish but instead we are arguing over it. Some are arguing over it being dead, some over where it was photographed, some are arguing over his rights to keep it, some over him posting it. I don't pretend to know what is right in this case because everyone has their own opinion and are entitled to them.
But in the past a lot of these debates started without any photographs being posted, they started when a person was lucky enough to catch a decent fish and in a report told us about it. As has been previously posted no sooner would the report be up and somebody would ask "Was it released?".
My opinion is this; Do not ask this question. Depending on the answer people are going to be offended. You could offend the poster just by asking as he may feel it's no business of yours and if he wanted you to know he would have said. If the answer was yes he or others could feel you were impugning the poster. If the answer was no you or others could be upset at the loss of the fish. All in all it's the anglers choice so why put him in a position to justify or defend himself.
Just my opinion.