Write to the Ministers ref. Shore Crab before its to late

email info@agriculture.gov.ie



Copy of letter from myself to Ministers
Dear Minister Smith, & Minister Sargent

I write this letter to make you aware of a serious situation that exists in the Suir Estuary. I am pretty certain that this affects other areas
in and around the coast as well. It involves the removal of small shore crabs from the food chain, this will result in the complete fall off
of fish in the area because this is the main item in the food chain , for fish along our coast. These shore crabs are being taken without any open or closed season,
in fact they have are been taken in the height of their season. Female crabs carrying eggs, small and large crabs too, because there is no size limit on what can be taken,
no open or closed season or no maximum or minimum amount that can be taken from the estuary.

This is serious, similar has happened before in the North Sea, where fish stocks and bird stocks were severely damaged, when too many sand eels were taken.
We are doing the same thing to the food chain, along the Irish coast. I would ask you as a matter of urgency, to have a look at this matter, I am not sure if the number
of crab are being recorded,because they are being off loaded at small harbours along the estuary and taken directly to the company in Dxxxxxx Exxx, which is
exporting them.

Please investigate this as soon as possible, as I think it is going to totally destroy the inshore fishing industry.

I'll send a copy right away.
Good stuff!

John D.

Dear James,

This is to confirm that I have received your email regarding the above and that I have put down a Parliamentary Question in the matter. I will be back in contact with you again immediately the reply is to hand.

With best regards.

Yours sincerely,


BXXXX XXXXXX T.D.

Hi all,

Just to let you know that I have wrote to all ministers and head's of state on the matter.

Regards,
John D.

I've been in touch with the Coastal Zone Managers office re: this subject. They did not know about this and thank us for informing them. They need a bit more information.

Can anyone say how the crabs are being removed? Where are they going - to whom? PM me if preferred.

Thanks,

Steven

Hi all,i`m new here but in relation to the above topic,its most likely "velvet crab"for the spanish market but if your right about bait for whelk pots then its "brown/edible crab"bodies after both nippers are snapped off.hope this helps. :wink: :wink: :wink: [/quote]

Its not velvet crab its the same crab we use as bait i have seen them of loading on to trailers .
They have about 600 pots per boat and of load them in sacks.

WHY OF LOAD AT A SMALL PIER AND THEN TAKE THEM BY ROAD THEY COULD JUST OF LOAD AT DUNMORE IN THE FIRST PLACE ?

there`s no money in shore crab to justify 600 pots,boat and licence all worth at least 100k,and boats large enough to fish even 200 pots could`nt get close enough to shore at enough marks to shoot all their pots.they land at local small harbours as this would be the area they fish their pots and most likely their home port.investigate further and i`m sure you`ll find that its velvet crab.

Boats called half deckers

why could they not fish 600 pots

Crabs are shore crab like i said i have seen them.

so much money in it some have stopped fishing out at sea ( do not use as much fuel)

why they do not land in Dunmore close to where they fish in the river Suir well i think i know but we will just wait and see

Well Ahab if you were watching the evening news about the plight if the Irish fishing fleet you would have seen a boat load of SHORE CRAB been unloaded at dunmore east. there was at least 200 bags of crab on one boat.

How the hell can any one involved in Government or Conservation plead ignorance in this case :x

i have done a bit of digging and i found this report.

Source http://www.answers.com

C. maenas has also caused significant problems in the Republic of Ireland where predation of bottom-cultured mussels has been recorded in several counties (Kerry, Wexford, Waterford), and a number of control programmes have been instigated by mussel producers. "Hard-eye" shrimp creels are typically used to fish C. maenas in Ireland; the creels are baited, deployed and fished in 24-hour cycles, being typically deployed in strings along the boundaries of mussel beds in order to lure the crabs out of the mussel beds. Some producers pay levies for the removal of crabs, but in most cases, C. maenas catches are sold for processing into food products. This is, however, a small market and the relatively low value of C. maenas (€500 per tonne) and high transport costs (refrigerated lorry €170 per tonne) means that fishing C. maenas is uneconomical unless it forms part of a control programme to protect more valuable shellfish beds [citation needed].

I do not know how recent this report is so figures could be different now.

hi lads,did`nt see the news but i hope for all our sakes that your wrong.i know for a fact that wrights of howth offer 25cent/kilo for shore crab,mostly through winter as velvets move close to shore crab ground and would be a by-catch,but very small market and totally impossible for any boat to even cover costs if targetting them.i dont think we`ve anything to worry about just yet.our worries lie in the years ahead with the inshore commercial fleet growing fast destroying the seabed in search of razor,cockle,mussel,scallop and longlining for pollock,squid,macks etc.(best bait=live sandeel,by the thousands),does`nt look very good.

Captain AHAB, I find it incredible that you are being so scepticle about the catching of SHORE crabs. Do you not believe what the two posts above are saying. I have seen what is being described and there are no untruths in the posts. Its about time people took seriously what is being said on the forum and wake up to the fact that trawlers are always looking for another source to plunder and exterminate. Every day there are trawlers in the estuaries and bays around the coasts of Ireland cleaning out what few fish are left for the shore anglers. this is about to get even worse with the cost of fuel increasing. Look back over the posts on cockle harvesting and read it in detaiol to see what was about to happen befoire it was stopped. Its up to the anglers to support each other and preserve what little stocks are left before we talk about fishing as a shore angler as something that was once done but no longer exists.

listen lads,i work in the fishing industry and see first hand what goes on,shore crab will never be fished commercially to any extent,and if we anglers can set our traps and collect as many crab as possible how can we expect to be taken seriously when we complain about others doing the same thing(they also have a licence,i dont,do u guys?).ministers just dont care about a few anglers or a few crab,so i think everybody that loves our sport should really educate themselves on inshore comm.fishing and the extent of damage it causes, this area of comm.fishing is becoming very popular as a whole because of fuel costs,decommissioning larger vessels,and new markets(seed mussel,shrimp,scallop etc.).not only do they destroy the sea bed but the amount of bait required daily is frightening(app.100kg -seed whiting,gurnard,plaice etc.).i dont want to see shore crab fished commercially either but i just think our efforts would be better served lobbying ministers on inshore fishing in general,if we can organise a report with clear facts,figures etc. on the unviability and detrimental effect of the inshore fleet versus leisure/sport(economic,environmental,h&s etc.)then we might get somewhere,these ministers only understand clear reports with facts and figures.all i`m saying is that i see a far more serious problem on the horizon,one which if left to fester might spell the end for all of us.

You do not believe us you do not believe what you see on RTE NEWS how can we all be so wrong and you so right.
How can we have fish inshore if there is nothing for them to feed on.
How can they live if there is no food.
WAKE UP

i never said that i dont believe you,i just think you`re making a mountain out of a mole hill.these guys are licenced and well within their rights to fish for crab but i still say there will never be a commercial shore crab fishery to any extent ,the only thing that might be achieved is a ban on bait collection or strict regulations,licences etc.then where would we be.think about it,your complaint to the ministers is-how come licenced crab fishermen are fishing for crab?.i just fear that if we charge up blind alleys lobbying ministers on non issues it wont be long before we`re seen as cranks and the subject of ridicule.in truth licenced fishermen would be within their rights to complain about bait collectors,so i`d rather save my voice for when the real sh1t starts hitting the fan.

Hi All,
I can see the frustration on one side due to removal of green crab but I can also see the points Capt ahab is making about inshore fishing in its entirety.

I have for years, seen inshore fishermen taking vast numbers of crabs, lobster, clams, razors and other shellfish quite within the law and doing untold damage. Match this with using undersized fish as bait by the box load. During the winter many of these fishermen change to shrimp fishing that take vast quantity's of juvenile fish and believe me when I say that most of this by-catch dies. Whats the answer? I do not know but the issue must be tackled in its entirety.

The most interesting Ahab says is that fishermen are licensed, anglers are not. So where does that leave anglers when lobbying? Not in a very strong position is the obvious answer. Fishermen will continue to react to market opportunities and will target fish/shellfish where there is money to be made.

Its obvious that decades of collecting shore crab for angling purposes has not had an impact on the crab population, especially if today trawlers are able to collect them by the ton.

I think if the commercial fishing of shore crab started 40-50 years ago the same could not be said.

I think you will find that on the whole anglers do have the environment in mind just look at the unwelcome changes that have had to be made to competition rules over the years.

If you went onto a forum for commercial fishermen I do not think that you would find many members discussing the preservation of marine life as vigorously as you find on here.

I think you ignore the lowly angler at your peril because we are the litmus paper that can prove the damage that inshore commercial fishing dose.
Just look at the changes that have been made to competition rules in recent years as a result of overfishing for example the L.S.D were allowed into competitions because of the fall off in numbers of edible round and flat fish and then the size restrictions on landed fish were reduced as a measure to keep anglers on the beaches, and then catch and release was introduced.

I remember when the Wicklow open was fished 20 years ago the tilly lights of the anglers could bee seen stretched from wicklow harbour to fivemile point. And anglers from all over the u.k used to come fish competitions in Ireland.

Just because the benefits of commercial fishing can be counted very easily as so few people actually benefit,this should not be a reason for ignoring the more widespread benefits that shore angling bring to the economy.

The angling industry has suffered decades of setbacks and forced changes due to the effects commercial fishing AND NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND so don't expect our silence anymore.

P.S
Ahab if you are irked by the fact that sea angling is not a licensed sport I for one can only say that if a license means that you cannot be rode roughshod over any more and your voice will be heard more loudly, then BRING IT ON

.....I for one can only say that if a license means that you cannot be rode roughshod over any more and your voice will be heard more loudly, then BRING IT ON

You think?

Consider the Salmon anglers situation: They need a licence for their sport, the price has doubled and re-doubled in recent years from 30 Euro to over 130 Euro, and they've found most of their rivers closed.

If you accept a Sea Angling licence, you accept the fact that nameless faceless bureaucrats have control of your sport.

murnblood do you also remember the skip loads of rotting fish after these comps.i remember comps being cancelled due to this at kilcoole and do u really think old tyres and cavity blocks in estuarys are environmentally friendly?licencing anglers would be disastrous and i for one would not accept it,so this leaves us in an awkward position.if we lobby hard and various studies/reports are commisioned then we open a can of worms that destroys our sport as we know it(licencing,no fish zones etc.).i urge you all to step back and look at the situation as it stands,we have it fairly good,licencing is probably on the way but the likes of trevor sargent dont need any encouragement to speed it up.if you educate yourself about comm.fishing you would understand that even if the price offered for shore crab doubled and demand increased 10 fold it would still not be economically viable to fish for them.this is a wild goose chase that will only serve to highlight the non-regulation of sea anglers and possible revenue for our useless government.