Flappers question in SA

In this months sea angler Alan Yates said he prefered using a normal 3 hook flapper over a 2 up 1down. He said he found the bottom hook less effective on the 2up 1 down on the strong tidal venues he fishes as the hook will be swepth back up the rig. I don't really understand this. Anyone got a further explaination.

Donagh

I have heard of this before but really I feel it's over the top anyalsis from him, a half decent bait would keep the snood tight to the bottom and really in such conditions I would like a bait on the bottom for flats which would be hammered to the bottom in a strong flow. If he was that concearned two SSG shots on his snood would quickly eliminate the issue :roll:

Everyone to their own style I guess!

I've been playing with that idea lately myself. Rather than risk weakening my snood by crimping shot onto it, I found my tackle shop stocks a range of tiny drilled bullets. Seems a better implementation of what sounds like a good idea in venues with a strong tidal run.

I'd noticed in club matches last year that everyone's catch rate tailed off in the main run of tide and was experimenting with wire booms and very short snoods to see if this would keep the bait on the bottom better, but I had a nightmare of a season and didn't really get enough fishing time in to come to a definite conclusion.

I'd be interested to hear other people's opinions on this topic.....

Sandman the little drilled bullets are spot on. wire booms n short snoods will work well in a good tide run- gives an easy target for fish! a good slack line should see the baits pinned anyway.

i think what Yates means is that the bottom snood fishes closer to the rig body than the other two snoods n he reckons it fishes poorer for this reason?

We were getting fish right in through the surf in darkness on dropping tides last year - it must have been like a washing machine down there. I figured the trick for the flatties had to be to nail the bait to the bottom....whatever the waves and tides were doing.

The idea behind either split shot or drilled bullet is that they are positioned on the line that it keeps the snood down yet is not so heavy or positioned near the bait that it buries the bait, especially on a sandy venue. Allowing a slack line will not necessarily work either as the run will simply take up the slack line in the tide and your line will be tight again in seconds only really allowing the top two snoods to go lower to the bottom and be bounced around by the tide. Personally as I said having one dedicated snood tight to the bottom is essential, and really using say 15lb snoods and a bunch of maddies will not be nailed to the bottom in a strong tide so using drilled bullet or shot may be the trick, In saying that flounders love movement, swings and roundabouts I guess :wink:

It's funny Yates states this method in his article as his team mate Chris Clark will always fish one below and consistently beats Yates on the Wicklow venues where there are notable tidal flows :lol:

Allowing a slack line will not necessarily work either as the run will simply take up the slack line in the tide and your line will be tight again in seconds only really allowing the top two snoods to go lower to the bottom and be bounced around by the tide.


ah meant to say casting at an angle up into the run should push hooks down. has worked for me in the past?

When fishing a venue you must take in account the depth of water you are fishing into. On a shallow beach the top hook, in a 3 hook flapper, is more than likley on the ground along with the bottom hook. Where when fishing a deep water venue the top hook is off the ground and the hight depends on the space between the snoods. In our case down in the Peoples Republic of Cork Garryvoe would be classed as a shallow beach and the Slob Bank a deep water venue. If unsure of the venue (beach) look for the surf. A surf breaking well off the shoreline would generaly mean a shallow beach, where the surf breaking close to the shore line would generlaly mean a deeper beach. Eastures have no written rule and are judged best by checking out the venue at low water and looking for tidal currants,

That should work but in a competition in darkness, casting at an angle to your peg gives a fair chance of getting tangled with the lad on the next peg. I was aiming at being able to flip out a rig more or less dead ahead of me and trying to make sure my baits stayed more or less on the bottom regardless of the angle or strength of tide run.

I'm also working with longer end traces these days and trying to keep the long rod low in the tripod to make the angle the line makes with the bottom shallower - I figure every little helps.

While I like the idea of being able to nip on a few shot as conditions demand, I don't trust them not to weaken a snood (I'm working on 12-15lbs usually) so that a valuable doggie can break me off - so I have a few sets of snoods with bullets on in various lengths to allow me to adapt to the conditions of the day. Means tying up a few more snoods. The things we try to get just one more fish.

I've spent quite a lot of time studying (-deleted by moderator-) the feeding habits of flatties in various aquariums (aquaria?) and most will not rise off the bottom to take food, although they clearly are able to see it drifting down to the bottom and orientate themselves accordingly. While I have seen such fish lunge off the bottom to catch a morsel, I'm of the opinion that these 'tame' fish have 'learned' that there isn't a tope or other predator about to swoop down on them if they break cover. So, I'm firmly of the belief that if the bait isn't nailed to the bottom, expect few flatties.

When fishing a venue you must take in account the depth of water you are fishing into. On a shallow beach the top hook, in a 3 hook flapper, is more than likley on the ground along with the bottom hook. Where when fishing a deep water venue the top hook is off the ground and the hight depends on the space between the snoods. In our case down in the Peoples Republic of Cork Garryvoe would be classed as a shallow beach and the Slob Bank a deep water venue. If unsure of the venue (beach) look for the surf. A surf breaking well off the shoreline would generaly mean a shallow beach, where the surf breaking close to the shore line would generlaly mean a deeper beach. Eastures have no written rule and are judged best by checking out the venue at low water and looking for tidal currants,

beautifully summed up in the northern english term "check the angle of your dangle" ahem! :wink:

Pat,

If I want all 3 of my baits on the bottom.....I'd use a sinker at the top of my trace...say 4oz gripper at the top and 6oz gripper at the bottom...and a small float bead just behind each hook....4"-6" or longer snoods would all be off the bottom but the trace would still be fixed down.

btw.....you must use a lighter lead at the top of the trace...otherwise it will go ass over tit as its cast... :lol:

Tom.

So Mark your secret is out your fishing off other peoples pegs :lol: :lol:

Thanks for your replies. An interesting topic for me as I normaly fish with 4/0 hooks on a pulley. Hopefully a few good dabs will be nabbed from all your advise.

Donagh

some great advice there will defo be trying that out with the lead above the trace