Coastline Access Permissions

Hi all,
I need of some advice please.
Post lockdown I would like to plan a couple of fishing trips with my two teenage (14/16) sons to some of the more remote parts of Ireland to get in some hopefully quality rock & surf angling. Google is showing me some really stunning locations - we fear no heights or long treks, but need the following guidance:

What is the legal AND socially courteous/appropriate way to go about accessing many of the more remote angling spots - here I specifically mean places that are a little off the beaten track and some ways from any parking lots or public access points.

I would never contemplate trespassing on private property without first approaching the nearest/likely landowner's homestead, to enquire whether access may be granted - is this a suitable approach? What in your experience works best? Are farmers generally amenable to allowing decent, sober habits, God Fearing, father/son combo's onto their land? Assuming one locates a potentially optimal location via googlemaps, and then locates the closest road/farm track, is it just the simple thing of driving up the driveway and politely asking if one would be permitted to traverse/access the shoreline? What happens if the ideal spot is on land that is not presently occupied - ie you arrive at a homestead and see that perhaps it is just a summer holiday home?

I for one would be very happy to offer either a small payment or fresh fish (assuming success) in lieu of payment, to leave my vehicle in a secure location. And it goes without saying that one would never litter, and leave/close any paddock gates etc as you found them?

Any views welcome.
thank you,
Gareth

Hi all,
I need of some advice please.
Post lockdown I would like to plan a couple of fishing trips with my two teenage (14/16) sons to some of the more remote parts of Ireland to get in some hopefully quality rock & surf angling. Google is showing me some really stunning locations - we fear no heights or long treks, but need the following guidance:

What is the legal AND socially courteous/appropriate way to go about accessing many of the more remote angling spots - here I specifically mean places that are a little off the beaten track and some ways from any parking lots or public access points.

I would never contemplate trespassing on private property without first approaching the nearest/likely landowner's homestead, to enquire whether access may be granted - is this a suitable approach? What in your experience works best? Are farmers generally amenable to allowing decent, sober habits, God Fearing, father/son combo's onto their land? Assuming one locates a potentially optimal location via googlemaps, and then locates the closest road/farm track, is it just the simple thing of driving up the driveway and politely asking if one would be permitted to traverse/access the shoreline? What happens if the ideal spot is on land that is not presently occupied - ie you arrive at a homestead and see that perhaps it is just a summer holiday home?

I for one would be very happy to offer either a small payment or fresh fish (assuming success) in lieu of payment, to leave my vehicle in a secure location. And it goes without saying that one would never litter, and leave/close any paddock gates etc as you found them?

Any views welcome.
thank you,
Gareth

My general rule of thumb is if there isn't a sign or a fence blocking me from accessing the land and it's the only viable route to the foreshore I will enter. I'm not breaking any laws or trespassing by doing this, I think it is only trespassing if there is a sign and you enter anyway or if the landowner asks you to leave and you don't. That's just me though and I don't always make the best decisions lol hopefully someone more knowledgeable will come along and give you the correct information

It is never OK to enter someones property without permission, regardless of whether there are signs posted or not.
Get permission first, treat the property with respect and leave everything as you found it.


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Hi all,
I need of some advice please.
Post lockdown I would like to plan a couple of fishing trips with my two teenage (14/16) sons to some of the more remote parts of Ireland to get in some hopefully quality rock & surf angling. Google is showing me some really stunning locations - we fear no heights or long treks, but need the following guidance:

What is the legal AND socially courteous/appropriate way to go about accessing many of the more remote angling spots - here I specifically mean places that are a little off the beaten track and some ways from any parking lots or public access points.

I would never contemplate trespassing on private property without first approaching the nearest/likely landowner's homestead, to enquire whether access may be granted - is this a suitable approach? What in your experience works best? Are farmers generally amenable to allowing decent, sober habits, God Fearing, father/son combo's onto their land? Assuming one locates a potentially optimal location via googlemaps, and then locates the closest road/farm track, is it just the simple thing of driving up the driveway and politely asking if one would be permitted to traverse/access the shoreline? What happens if the ideal spot is on land that is not presently occupied - ie you arrive at a homestead and see that perhaps it is just a summer holiday home?

I for one would be very happy to offer either a small payment or fresh fish (assuming success) in lieu of payment, to leave my vehicle in a secure location. And it goes without saying that one would never litter, and leave/close any paddock gates etc as you found them?

Any views welcome.
thank you,
Gareth

My general rule of thumb is if there isn't a sign or a fence blocking me from accessing the land and it's the only viable route to the foreshore I will enter. I'm not breaking any laws or trespassing by doing this, I think it is only trespassing if there is a sign and you enter anyway or if the landowner asks you to leave and you don't. That's just me though and I don't always make the best decisions lol hopefully someone more knowledgeable will come along and give you the correct information

If there is no obvious right of way, regardless of signage you are then trespassing - the law in Ireland falls heavily on the side of the landowner, the constitution guarantees the right to private ownership

I would not trespass - many owners have constructed their fencing/walls etc. to prevent access to the foreshore - they could be very motivated to exercise their right to get you off their land - not worth it!

It is not like other countries where you have the right to roam and the landowner then has to inform you why access to their land is denied

always ask for permission would be my advice

Thanks for the guidance gents. A slightly different angle/question:
Who owns the actual coastline line/foreshore - here i mean the land from the High Water mark down to the Sea/Low Water mark.
In South Africa, that area is classified as "Admiralty Land" and it belongs to the State - thus the beaches and rocks making up the immediate foreshore may never be privately owned.
So in Ireland, for instance, if i were to gain access to a section of foreshore (legally), would one then be able to traverse along the coastline (staying below the HW mark) unimpeded without facing the wrath of local landowners.
It would seem rather daft if one needed to walk inland and approach each homestead to ask permission, if say you wanted to walk 5-10km along the shoreline.

Thanks for the guidance gents. A slightly different angle/question:
Who owns the actual coastline line/foreshore - here i mean the land from the High Water mark down to the Sea/Low Water mark.
In South Africa, that area is classified as "Admiralty Land" and it belongs to the State - thus the beaches and rocks making up the immediate foreshore may never be privately owned.
So in Ireland, for instance, if i were to gain access to a section of foreshore (legally), would one then be able to traverse along the coastline (staying below the HW mark) unimpeded without facing the wrath of local landowners.
It would seem rather daft if one needed to walk inland and approach each homestead to ask permission, if say you wanted to walk 5-10km along the shoreline.

Check out this thread discussing the issue, has plenty of information viewtopic.php?f=12&t=17349

Thanks for the guidance gents. A slightly different angle/question:
Who owns the actual coastline line/foreshore - here i mean the land from the High Water mark down to the Sea/Low Water mark.
In South Africa, that area is classified as "Admiralty Land" and it belongs to the State - thus the beaches and rocks making up the immediate foreshore may never be privately owned.
So in Ireland, for instance, if i were to gain access to a section of foreshore (legally), would one then be able to traverse along the coastline (staying below the HW mark) unimpeded without facing the wrath of local landowners.
It would seem rather daft if one needed to walk inland and approach each homestead to ask permission, if say you wanted to walk 5-10km along the shoreline.

once you are on or below the HW mark its the commons bar some rare exceptions - so yes you can walk along the coast from an access point

The correct legal interpretation of trespass is not as cut and dried as some would like you to believe...

You can reference the actual legislation here http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1994/act/2/section/13/enacted/en/html
As some of the older members may be aware the website was threatened with a legal action pertaining to comments posted here in relation to a dispute around access to the foreshore in Kerry, so it became my business to have to look into this very carefully...

Technically trespass requires you to either "cause fear in another person" or cause damage to their property, which can in a rural context include damage to standing crops, leaving gates open, bringing a dog into an area holding sheep, or in the case of elderly people owing to the prevalence of rural crime, just being in the area. Living in fear is defined by the WHO as torture. Exactly.

There are multiple legal sources for trespass, not just the one quoted above, which makes it all the more tricky...

As a general rule, you should seek permission from the landowner. Many landowners post notices referencing that anyone accessing a river (such as the Moy) through their land is liable for any damage and that the landowner is not responsible for any damage to them. In Ireland it is not always easy to identify who the landowner is... it may not be the local house or farmstead, they may not even live in Ireland. The best place to identify land ownership is the Property Registry Authority which is now online. http://www.landdirect.ie
There is the added complexity associated with commonage, large areas often near rivers and lakes and occassionally the coast, where the land is owned effectively by a cooperative, or where it is not owned by them, but where they hold rights for grazing and such like.

There is a really good piece, from the perspective of the landowner here, which illustrates their legal position and includes "not set out to intentionally harm trespassers". This includes causing fear, so threats are not just uncalled for, they are illegal. Not that you should get to that... if someone informs you that you are on their land, that it is private property and that you should not be there and that they do not want you there, you should leave. END OF. LEAVE. Thank them, be polite and leave.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/farming/dealing-with-trespassers-830505.html

Some ask nicely, some don't, some have genuine reason to be fearful of strangers, so do the right thing and leave.

The only exception to this is where there is a defined and legally recognised right of way. In Ireland, there are remarkably few of these as illustrated by previous posters, so unless you are ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN you are on one, do the right thing and leave.

My personal experience over 25 years in Mayo is that I have been denied access twice, once by a known £"$*^"£$ who had a beef with the county council over a road and was making as much of a stink as possible (and more besides) to get the road repaired and another in regard to a sheep farmer who was "sick and tired of you f*****g Jackeens who wouldn't know a gate if it was slapped on your a**e, bringing your f&*"^£$g Poodles down here terrorising my sheep"... to which I replied something about winning one in a row...

In most circumstances, if you identify a rock mark or an isolated beach, you will find a route to it.
The VAST MAJORITY of farmers I have met are happy to have the chat, tell you you're wasting your time (usually true in my case), and wish you well, especially if you mention things about respecting the countryside, cleaning up after you, closing gates etc.

Smiling and having a chat helps...

K

It is never OK to enter someones property without permission, regardless of whether there are signs posted or not.
Get permission first, treat the property with respect and leave everything as you found it.


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well said above i would do same. also some land owners/farmers can be very stand offish at first and you cannot blame them in this day and age. Some just say no off the bat no changing there mind. References i.e. phone numbers from other land owners /farmers also helps as its amazing how many farmers no each other from different ends of the country or know some farmer who knows some other farmer showing id like driving license etc.can help and once giving permission dont let others know,and if you have a friend asking about your permission dont untill you have asked the farmer and you can 100% thrust who your speaking up for and then bring the person to meet farmer/landowner in person if landowner farmer agrees to it.